‍Ajit Nawalkha (0s): One of the reasons why I I love business is because there is a Certainty of growth in it. Hmm. There's a Certainty of saying that irrespective of what happens, there will be an outcome of a personal transformation. Failure or success. Either of them will form you in some way. Yeah. Nobody wants you to change when you're in a job. Nobody wants you to stay the same if you're in a business. But when you are doing a job, the only thing that people want you to do is to be the same
Travis Chappell (30s): Welcome. back to the show. I'm Travis Chappell. And I believe that if you can connect with the best, you can become the best So. after creating 800 podcast episodes about building your network, I've come to realize that networking is really just making friends if you doing it the right way. Anyway, join me as I. make friends with world class athletes like Shaquille, O'Neal, entertainers like Rob, Dyrdek, authors like Dr, Nicole, Lappera, former presidents like Vicente Fox, or even the occasional FBI hostage negotiator, billionaire, real estate mogul, or polarizing political figures. So. if you want to make more friends that help you become a better version of yourself, then subscribe to the show and keep on listening. 'cause this is Travis Makes Friends. What is going on everybody? Welcome back to their episode of Travis Makes Friends.
Travis Chappell (1m 10s): Today I'm making friends with Ajit Nawalkha Ajit, welcome to the show, man.
Ajit Nawalkha (1m 15s): Thank you so much for inviting me, Travis. Of
Travis Chappell (1m 17s): Course, of course. Here in, I was gonna say sunny, beautiful Austin, but it's actually like thunder, lightning raining right now, which I was not expecting, but I welcome it though. I love the
Ajit Nawalkha (1m 27s): Austin's got all the seasons. It's got the really, really hot summer. Yeah. Weird fall. And then really, really cold So. it really depends when you come in. Great
Travis Chappell (1m 36s): Place to live then, huh? Yeah.
Ajit Nawalkha (1m 38s): You get to experience all the seasons just like life.
Travis Chappell (1m 41s): Where, where were you before? Austin,
Ajit Nawalkha (1m 43s): LA la. Yeah. We lived in LA for about five years, and before that I was world traveling with my then girlfriend, now partner, my love wife. I mean, for two years before that, I lived in Malaysia, co Lumpur. Okay. Like 10 years.
Travis Chappell (1m 55s): So you lived all over the world? Traveled all over the world. Where's your favorite spot?
Ajit Nawalkha (1m 58s): Ooh, that's a really difficult one for me. I mean,
Travis Chappell (1m 60s): You're obviously, that travels
Ajit Nawalkha (2m 1s): Around the world. Yeah. It's like a little hard to do, but lately I was missing Southeast Asia. It's been a long time. Okay. Been there, like, just being there for just You know a month or something. Yeah. And there's a season in my life where I am writing my new book. Okay. And I was like being called to write it there, I think. Yeah. So that's probably the reason why Yeah.
Travis Chappell (2m 20s): Might take a trip. Yeah. To Southeast Asia soon then. Yeah.
Ajit Nawalkha (2m 24s): For a Month.
Travis Chappell (2m 24s):  Sweet. Well, listen, man, I, I appreciate you coming on the show. I love having these conversations because You know, it, it, I, I don't find that a lot of career counselors talked to their kids in high school and said like, all right, you can be a doctor, you can be a lawyer, or you can be the founder of a coaching Institute. Right. So how do we get to where you are now? Let's go back in time and see about nine year old, legit. Tell me where you were, what was going on, what was life like for you?
Ajit Nawalkha (2m 52s): Yeah. So I grew up in India in a small town called Epper. It's not really that small, but it's a small town comparative to India with like 30 million people there. So pretty small, just, yeah, teeny tiny or Brandy It was like tiny, teeny, tiny spot. So I grew up in this small town called Jaipur And. I grew up in a neighborhood that's the old city of Jor. So the beautiful pictures that you see of palaces and everything, I was surrounded by all of them. Hmm. And at the same point in time, I was pretty, not really, it, it wasn't an abundant life, let's just say that way. I, we grew up in a household with 23 people sharing the same space because my parents and my family lived there. And then my, his brother and his family lived there. His parents lived there. His parents brother and his entire, entire line of kids were kids and adults lived there.
Ajit Nawalkha (3m 36s): So we were like 23 people Wow. Sharing one property because of that. Of course, as you can imagine, there was never really abundance of space. and we were living in such conditions, not because it was something that we could have chose differently now, because we didn't have money So. it was not a lot of abundance that I grew up with. And that's why our, my entire family always focused on the idea that you should go get a job as soon as you, you're done with us. You should go get a job and make some money so you can live abundantly So. it was the common narrative throughout our entire story, entire childhood. And one of the reasons was because my father was an entrepreneur. Okay. And he couldn't make it work. He couldn't make it work the way he wanted to. Of course, he couldn't provide for us in the sense of abundantly.
Ajit Nawalkha (4m 19s): Sure. As much as his heart would want, he would still take care of us very well. So that initial idea of saying, okay, let's become successful in India at the time, to some extent even now, was become a doctor, become an engineer, or become an accountant. These were the three professions that were wildly celebrated. They were very intellectual. They're very easy to sell in the open space to be able to say, oh, you're an engineer, you're a doctor. Very secure, very secure, very safe jobs. And I wasn't above average student. So wasn't brilliant, but wasn't the kid who wouldn't get a grades. Like I would get a's B's, You know, maybe not a plus. So I was one of those kids that like, okay, this kid's gonna be an engineer. And that was my track, and that's what I wanted to do for the first part of my teens, because I was like, all right, that's my way out.
Ajit Nawalkha (5m 4s): I of course don't wanna live in this life. I wanted to. And my biggest dream was to buy a house for my parents. Okay. Because It was like, I want them get out of this place. You know we could do better. And so I got on this track, and when I was applying for engineering colleges at that time, I started to talk to some engineers. And. I started to look at their life. And I felt miserable looking at their life. Hmm. Because their lives look really miserable. So what people who have not done engineering or in that profession may not realize that while it's a really intellectual career, most of your career you're doing repetitive, boring tests. You're just looking at a code and bug testing it.
Ajit Nawalkha (5m 46s): Yeah. For months, sometimes years. Yeah. It is not fun. It sounds really fun. It is, yes. Intellectually advanced, but not stimulating. Yeah. You're not doing new things. And I was talking to these people who were just in recent graduates from really good schools working across the globe and doing really mundane, boring jobs. And there was nothing about that that was exciting for me. Hmm. I loved chemistry. I loved physics, I loved biology. I love humans. But, and, and curiosity is something that was evident in me at the time, but that wasn't the track that I wanted to take. So I wrote a letter to my father saying, Hey, listen, I know this is the dream, but I can't do it. I just cannot be this engineer.
Ajit Nawalkha (6m 27s): And my father's a very kind man. So he was like, okay, well, would you like to do, I was like, I don't know. Perfect. Which was, which was, that's exactly what I wanted to hear a great answer. It wasn't a great answer. My mother was not happy to say in, in summary. And so my, my mother's kind of like all sad and crying of course. And my dad goes, all right, listen, your mom's not happy about this. I understand you don't know. Yeah. But I can also tell you this for sure, that I can give you three years. I can support you for another three years while you graduate. You must graduate. And. I can give you three years. And if you do not figure out what you wanna do, unfortunately I won't be able to support you anymore. Yeah. That put me on a fast track of really trying to figure out life.
Ajit Nawalkha (7m 8s): Sure. It would put me on a journey of finding some jobs early on, working with entrepreneurs. And as I started to lean into the world, I realized what I was really exciting for me is education and media. And those two became my highlights of the career at the time. Yeah. Or my journey at the time where I, I loved working with people who were trying to help other people or education wise. And at the same point of time, I loved media like advertising and newspapers and TV and stations and this stuff. Right. At that time, podcasting wasn't a thing. So this is 2000, 2008. I, I've graduated. I did work for some media houses, some entrepreneurial company, some educators locally in the city. I grew up in Jaipur, and at that time there was a friend of mine who was living in Malaysia.
Ajit Nawalkha (7m 50s): And. I was really, really, really getting interested in internet because I, at that time was working for a media house and had it got them to invest in a startup, which was a Facebook-like startup. At that time, Facebook wasn't popular in India. I didn't even know if its existence. When we started coding the, the website. Okay. We built it and Facebook came along to India crushed us. And I was like, there's no way, but this is the future. Yeah. It has to be. It's just so good. There's no way, this is not a part of the big future. And there was no education in India. So this friend of mine who was in Malaysia says, Hey, listen, I know this tiny little company, they're a startup. They only have like seven, eight people. And the way they are attracting talent right now is they're saying, come be in Malaysia. We'll teach you everything about internet.
Ajit Nawalkha (8m 31s): You work for us for like one or two years. And because we are in Malaysia, you can travel all of Southeast Asia, just take the weekend in Thailand. Take the weekend in Bali. Basically, the pitch was, have a great time while learning something while you help us make money. Like sold. Let's go. Done. Yeah. Yes. Done. It's a great offer. Right. That company was called Mindvalley. Do you do You know of Mindvalley at all? Yeah. Yep. So Mindvalley is this big personal growth juggernaut today. At that time, it was a tiny operation of five people. Yeah. Working out of a house with basically mind, like not even being the brand. We were a bunch of different websites basically. Okay. We were almost like an agency that took commission for selling a program for somebody who was actually a personal growth author and was bringing some great work into the world.
Ajit Nawalkha (9m 13s): Got it. Always great work. Always related to personal growth. I joined the company at that time and it would fast track me to where I am today. And the reason why it fast tracked me is because it introduced me to internet. It integrated my passion for media, integrated my passion for education and training, and it gave me an opportunity to test out all my ideas. So in six, seven years of work that I did with Mindvalley at the time, I went from an intern to the CEO of the company. Wow. And built the company from whatever, five, 10 people. By the time I had, I, I was CEO of the company, we had like 80 employees. Yeah. So we really, really created this company really fast.
Travis Chappell (9m 50s): Are what are mom and dad thinking during this time when you, when you moved to
Ajit Nawalkha (9m 53s): Malaysia to mom
Travis Chappell (9m 54s): And dad? Dad,
Ajit Nawalkha (9m 54s): I was able to, so when I, when I joined Mindvalley was maybe 24. Okay. When I was 29. So right before 30, I bought them a house. It was my livestream. Yeah. So that was also some very fun things. Yeah. They did not understand. Yeah. They were proud of that. I had the title CEO, they were really excited about that. Yeah. And so when I said in 20 14, 20 15, early 2015 that I'm quitting being CEO, And I, when I start my own thing, they were again disappointed. They were like, oh my goodness. Yeah. You finally have a stable career. We can tell people you are CEO of a company. People understand what you're doing. Right. Right. Finally, and now you're telling us, oh no, I'm not gonna do that. I'm gonna go do this new thing. Yeah. Right. Which I don't know again what it is all about.
Ajit Nawalkha (10m 35s): It's called coaching. And they're like, what does that even mean? It is 2015. Right. Still, people don't understand what coaching is. But at that time, they definitely had no idea
Travis Chappell (10m 44s): What
Ajit Nawalkha (10m 44s): Coaching was. It's, it's been a fun ride.
Travis Chappell (10m 46s): Yeah. I mean, you just, you you got that entrepreneurial itch You know what I mean? Like, I feel like it's almost like a disease where we just crave uncertainty where like most people crave Certainty You. know what I mean? Yeah. But I think it's almost uncertainty. I've thought about this a lot. I feel like it's more just uncertainty or it's Certainty disguised as uncertainty. Meaning that like, if you have a job, job and, and even like being ceo EO of Mindvalley, to me that's an entrepreneurial venture. 'cause you started as an intern, it was a tiny company. Like you're, you're malleable. You're moving things, your ideas are being accepted And in like, it, that's an entrepreneurial venture. It's not taking a job like you would've been doing as an engineer or whatever. To me, it's exactly that. It's like it's uncertainty or Certainty disguises disguises uncertainty.
Travis Chappell (11m 30s): Because, because a job job has just as much uncertainty, even if it's a secure job. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Whereas the entrepreneurial path to me seems like a longer, a longer term, more certain path because you have at least some con like you are, you are the one that's in the driver's seat. At least you are the one that's in control. And even though there's a lot of external circumstances, and it's a higher risk profile, and there's things that can go wrong and You know the failure's guaranteed and the success is not, and all the other You know tropes and things that you can assign to it. At the end of the day, it's still on you. And, I think there's like something pure about that. I think like people who tend to be entrepreneurial embody that, that spirit of, of just like, yeah, yeah.
Travis Chappell (12m 14s): I know that I have, have this secure path over here, but it's secure. It's quote unquote secure. It's not really secure You know what I mean? And I loved Jim Carrey's commencement address that he gave, I forget which like what school it was, but he talks about how his dad wanted to be a, a Comedian and, and he said something like, my father could have been a great Comedian, but he gave all that up to be, it might have been an accountant. It was like a really secure job or something. He's like, so he chose security. And he was like, when my dad turned 50 something, he lost that secure job and taught me a really important lesson that you can fail at what you don't want, so you might as well take a chance on doing what you love. And I'm like, that was like one of those things.
Travis Chappell (12m 56s): I was like, yes. Yes. Exactly. Like yes. Even you can fail at the thing. You don't, you can fail at being an engineer, which is something you absolutely don't want to do. So like, well, if there's, if failure's an option on every path, then why not pursue the thing that I want to pursue the most? And there's probably more enjoyment and fulfillment in the process of pursuit, even without the attainment of the goal than there is in not pursuing it at all. Yeah. And you seem to be the type of person that's going to always pursue the thing that fired you up, even if it doesn't really make sense on paper. Would you
Ajit Nawalkha (13m 32s): Agree with that? You're, you're absolutely right. And, I, think with life, the limited experience of life that I have, I would concur what Jim Carrey said, the only Certainty that you have is uncertainty. There is no Certainty in life or anything really. Like you could find the, the partner that fits your profile perfectly. And it could be like the match made in heaven, and it can fall apart if you don't work on it constantly. Could you could build a perfect career, or the perfect job, get the perfect degree, and could just fall apart on itself if you don't constantly work on it. I think what I've found to be true for me is that one of the reasons why I I love business is because there is a Certainty of growth in it.
Ajit Nawalkha (14m 15s): Hmm. There's a Certainty of saying that irrespective of what happens, there will be an outcome of a personal transformation. Failure or success. Either of them will form you in some way, and you'll stay present to it. If you're an entrepreneur, you will forget about it if you're not an entrepreneur, because it's just safe environment that nobody wants you to change when you're in a job. Nobody wants you to stay the same if you're in a business. Yeah. Like everybody is conspiring to say, how can I get this person to be better? Like, all of my team members want me to get better. Right. If I am a content creator, like your team is probably wanting you to get better every single time you turn on the mic, you wanna get better. Your team wants you to get better. People are listening to you, wants you to get better.
Ajit Nawalkha (14m 55s): Yeah. Everybody is cheering you on to say, get better, irrespective. You will not fail. Even if nobody's listening, you are trying to get better. Right. Same is true for me. But when you are doing a job, the only thing that people want you to do is to be the same most of the time. Right. I have a Certainty of here. I've produced the video, it's gonna go to my editor. My editor needs to be able to deliver the same times, the same task, same quality multiple times in the day. Yep. Right? Yep. So the inspiration for being entrepreneur to me is that everybody cheers you on to grow. And that's exciting for me. Hmm. As an entrepreneurial venture, I actually need to be way more certain because a lot of salaries depend on me.
Ajit Nawalkha (15m 40s): Yes. Right. So there is, there's this dance of Certainty and Certainty that we all have to have. Right. I think that dance is exciting for me. And it wasn't initially when I started, I was just chasing some career in media or, or education because those were my drivers. It happens to be that this is also one of the most exciting times to be in those careers. It wasn't by this didn, didn't know this will happen. Sure, sure. But it's exciting that I'm here at the right time at the right place.
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Travis Chappell (17m 41s): Where do you think that clarity came from? So early on for you to know that I want to do something in media, or I want do something in education where like, I think think it's one thing to know what you want and pursue it. And it's another thing to just not know what you want. And I feel like that that's where there, I feel like there's a strong percentage of people that are just floating in that unfamiliar circle of just like, I know I don't want to be doing what I'm doing now, but I'm not exactly sure what I want to be doing next, or what I wanna be doing in 10 years from now. How did you figure that out?
Ajit Nawalkha (18m 13s): I would argue that it's not that they don't know. I would think that it is that they know, but they don't know how to pursue it. So let me give you my example. So, it's relatable that way. Very early on, I loved my teachers And. I loved studying. Like I didn't care for the grades as much. I didn't like testing, but I loved the art of studying. I didn't read books on personal development and so forth growing up. But I would pick my history book, And I would tell myself the story of how the World War II was fought. Not as how it's written, but almost like, oh. And then Germany did this. And then Russia came on this front and us said, Hey, we are gonna join the war. And then they all conspired to finally beat the Nazis.
Ajit Nawalkha (18m 55s): So I'm telling myself a story. So clearly I love education. Clearly I love my teachers, and my teachers just love me because of that. Because I actually loved just, I would sit up like chemistry. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, and then this chemical mixed with this chemical and edge two. Whoa. Is he goes to water. Holy cow. That's how it's structured. Right. And, I would know the structures of it because it was just fun for me. I was just curious as a kid, always. So I knew that I will love education. Mm. I for that matter. There was a point in my life where I was like, maybe I just wanna be a teacher. Yeah. Just a teacher. Not nothing to do with media. And then I found that I loved media because I, even till date, I obsess over movies and the storytelling in movies. Like I would, I can almost say movie seven times if it's a good one.
Ajit Nawalkha (19m 36s): Yeah. And it's not because it's just, I'm not just sitting back and watching the movie. I'm going, oh, and then, huh. Okay. And then the shot has been taken this way and Wow, that's such a You know. How did they do that? That must be so cool. That must be so cool to be on a set. And so to me, media was exciting because of that. It was like, oh, media has all these dynamic elements. You can influence somebody's emotions while just telling a story on camera. You're not there. Right. Right. You're not feeling the feelings. You're not smelling anything. Yeah. But you smell,
Travis Chappell (20m 5s): It's not even
Ajit Nawalkha (20m 5s): A real story. You can smell it when somebody takes the right shot of the food. Yeah. Right. Almost you feel like, Hmm, I'm there. I can, I can feel that food suddenly. Right. Right. So I was present to it. I didn't know that there was a career that's possible that I do today. Of course not. Yeah. There's no way you stumble onto it. But what you, I think do is, like you said, you say like how Jim Carrey said and how you refer to it is you find that thing and then you go, I'm gonna do something that feels good. Because uncertainty is just what life is anyways. So I'm gonna just do what feels good, and maybe I'll find the way. Just pull the thread. Yeah. Just keep pulling the thread. Yeah. And then you, like, again, if you even look at my today career, I'm an entrepreneur today, but eight years ago, before, when I started my company seven years ago, when I started my company before that, I was employed by a company that did education and media.
Ajit Nawalkha (20m 52s): And media.
Travis Chappell (20m 52s): Right, right,
Ajit Nawalkha (20m 53s): Right. So, it wasn't like it was a straight path. Go become an entrepreneur and become the teacher yourself. That was not the straight path. The path was, I used to work for a media house that introduced me to the idea, internet is interesting, we should do something about it. That introduced me to this company that somehow magically had the same combination that I wanted to have, which is education and media. At that time, I didn't understand how education, because I didn't understand personal growth at that time. I, that was an education that came to me much later. So It was like, oh, people can sell that. Like you could talk about law of attraction and people would buy that. Right. What the Heck is this law, first of all. Right. I'd never heard that there were laws beyond You know legal law.
Ajit Nawalkha (21m 34s): Like what is this law that you talking about? Like, yeah. What are you talking about? So I stumbled into this life because I kept pulling the thread. And, I think all of us are aware of these threads around us, but none of these threads are ever gonna be safe when you pull them first. Yeah. Yeah. But give it enough time and everything is safe enough, as safe as it can get.
Travis Chappell (21m 55s): Exactly. Right. Exactly that. Yeah. Man, that's the whole thing, is I think people just get too wrapped up and chasing what other people think that they should be chasing. You get the job that pays you the six figures. 'cause you're You know the engineer or whatever. And then you start filling up your monthly expenses with a bunch of stuff that you think people think you should have. Right. The nicer house, the nicer cars, the nicer restaurants, the better food, the nicer clothes, the be like, you just start and then all of a sudden it's like, well, well, I can't take this massive risk and of, and risk losing this job because if I, if I don't have that, I'm lose my cars, I'm lose my house, my credit's gonna be screwed. Like I'm You know what, like now I'm, I'm stuck here.
Travis Chappell (22m 38s): Hmm. Because all I've been doing for the past 15 years is what everybody else said I should be doing. Rather than ever taking any sort of inward look and saying like, do I even want this You know? Is this the mountain that I want to spend my life climbing? You know when I get to the peak am I'm gonna be looking at the other mountain and being like, Hmm. Seems like I should have been on top of that mountain You. know what I mean? But I'm over on this mountain. And then to restart at this point, like you said, like every time, like the more you continue to put it off, the more difficult it becomes to take the, the plunge, because
Ajit Nawalkha (23m 12s): You've set a standard of life and Sure. You're not unwilling to let go of that standard of life.
Travis Chappell (23m 16s): Right. And then you get married, and then you have kids and you got expenses associated with all of that. And it's just like every time you keep adding in all this other stuff, it's just like, man, that's when you have people that just are in this cycle of just complacency and mediocrity and borderline depression. And it's not a factor of anything other than they're spending the majority of their waking hours doing something that does not excite them or fulfill them or make them happy in the least. Yeah. And it's like one of the more You know sad things. I think that's out there, especially as, as, as Americans like in America specifically, it's because everything else is taken care of.
Ajit Nawalkha (23m 57s): Yeah. No, but it's true for every, everywhere in the world. Yeah. Like most of, most, for that matter, all of the world, I would say about 80, 90% of us have chosen careers because that's what society told us. Hmm. Interesting. It's, it's not because we chose the career. Yeah. There might be some sense of excitement in that direction. Sure. But we never fully pursued it. And, and to be very honest, it's also an interesting curiosity. After talking to a lot of my students, what I've found is a lot of people do love their careers. They do appreciate what they have, but they want more. And, and they, it's not that they go, oh, I don't never wanted to be an engineer. They're like, I will always wanted to be an engineer. Yeah. I wanted to do this work. And there is more desire in me.
Ajit Nawalkha (24m 38s): Sure. And that's the comfort they need to break is they need to go, okay, there is, yes, you could work X number of hours as an engineer and then you can find time for your passion. Sometimes that passion might be you singing. Sure, sure. And and that's absolutely okay and comfortable. It also is, is I'm becoming more and more present to it because I do interact with a lot of individuals that are more in their forties and fifties. They have the kids and they have everything. And when we speak to them and when I'm speaking and coaching them, I've, I found a lot of times it's, they don't have the same level of ambition that you And. I might have Travis and it's by choice. Yeah. It's not because they cannot have it. It's because they have inquired within and they have gone You know what? I just don't think what is mediocre for you is mediocre for me.
Ajit Nawalkha (25m 22s): What is ambitious for you is not ambitious for me. You know how, if you'll watch most successful social media entrepreneurs, especially the ones that talk about a lot about their life on social media. I wake up at 4:00 AM and then I go meditate for an hour and then I take an ice bath and then I go to the gym and then And I the gym. That's the time when I connect with my wife because in the gym we run together and we are synchronous and then we meditate for one hour with our kids. You know that crazy life, and I'm sure you've met this, or the individuals that say, You know what? I wake up at 6:00 AM one in the morning and six to nine, I've already got on all my work done. And 9:00 AM I'm doing my team meetings and 12 o'clock I meet my clients. That's the popular story. Yeah. Yeah. Social media. And that might be their life.
Ajit Nawalkha (26m 2s): And, I have nothing against it. And. I have lived that life at one point because I thought that's the way entrepreneurship is done. Right. Entrepreneurship, a number of hours you put into the thing. Because I can outwork anyone. And I really can, if I get to it. And I know that about myself. And I also found the truth about my own life, is that I don't wanna be a successful entrepreneur that just raced all their life. I wanna be a successful entrepreneur who had a beautiful relationship with their wife, who had time for their kids, who really invested time with their kids. Yeah. That there were actually connected to their parents. They would actually not just make it a weekend activity, but actually go with them anywhere whenever they felt like who had real friendships that were from childhood buddies and new friends.
Ajit Nawalkha (26m 44s): I ask myself that, do I want to be just because somebody else is setting a standard? This is a classic case of sometimes standards being set by somebody else. Yeah. Right. That seem right. But are completely wrong. Right. So the standard of should I be working X number of hours become, maybe I would become more richer because of that or more wealthier because of that, but will I have a richer life? Let's just say that. Right. And that brought my attention to that. There is no reason whatsoever that I, you or anybody really in the world should set somebody else's standard. But we must set our own standards. The thing that I'm trying to pursue in the world now, that's the creation I'm creating with the book I'm working on right now, is I want us all to take a step back and stop wondering what's the right way to live the life?
Ajit Nawalkha (27m 32s): I don't want you to wonder, looking at somebody else saying, Hey, that's how that person says And. I really like their personality and they're so successful. They're so wealthy. And so that is the life I want. Instead, I want to take a minute and really ask yourself, if there was no limitations, if everything that was told to you around how life should be, what life should be, how much money you should have, how many kids you should have, was all bullshit. All bullshit. The only truth was what's really driving you now? And if you could focus on that for a hot minute, and once you focus on that, what's the answer that comes through? And you would find, or I found for myself. So all the baggage goes away. Hmm. Suddenly you don't get defined by world standards.
Ajit Nawalkha (28m 14s): You get defined by what is my standard. And what I've found is the clearer I am about my standard Yeah. The more joyous I live on a day-to-day basis. And honestly, most of the times I surpass my own standards because of that.
Travis Chappell (28m 28s): Yeah. Yeah. To get clear on what it is that actually makes you, you rather than adhering to somebody else's arbitrary version of what you should be.
Ajit Nawalkha (28m 39s): Yeah. And and what makes you you and what is it that you desire. Yeah. Not what the world desires. Not what somebody says you should desire. What do you desire? And it is so fascinating that when people start to really lay out their desires, if I was to ask you your desires Travis for the next three years, you may be able to blurt it out so easily. If I get you into a trance-like state and say, all right, let's go. Let's say what your desires are. It'll be so different than what you might have been thinking from your mind because your heart tells different. And what's funny is if you write down your three year desire, and this is for all the listeners and watchers, if you write down your three year desires, truly from your heart, I promise you in the next 18 months you'll have it.
Ajit Nawalkha (29m 20s): Hmm. It doesn't even take three years. And then you can ask that question again and again. It'll be a lesser time than whatever number that you put to that desire just till the time. It's from your heart. Not bullshit. Like, Hey, I wanna be a billionaire in three years subject. 'cause that's not from your heart. That's from Elon Musk's standards. Right. Let's be very real. Right. Right. From your own standard, from your own perspective, from your own goals. You tell your heart's desire. I tell you, in 18 months you're going to have it. Or 20 months you're gonna have it. If you have a 20 year desire, it'll get done in 10. Right. But you gotta know it's, it's gotta come from you. Yeah. It cannot come from what the world tells you
Travis Chappell (29m 54s): Just because of the alignment with
Ajit Nawalkha (29m 56s): Alignment and because you will find you. Have you ever se has it happened to you? It has happened to me when I was chasing a goal that was not true to me is that I chase the goal in about three months. And. I, don't chase it. Yeah. Has that happened to you ever? It does happen, right? Yeah. You
Travis Chappell (30m 9s): Set a goal and then you just kind of, you fizzle out because it's, it's, and not through a lack of, of discipline, but more like a lack of desire.
Ajit Nawalkha (30m 18s): You're generally a disciplined person. You're like, I do everything else. Why am I bombing on this one thing? It's mostly because you actually don't want it.
Travis Chappell (30m 25s): Don't want it. Yeah.
Ajit Nawalkha (30m 26s): Right. Right. So, it was a part of my life, so, so if you would meet me say five years ago, you would go, oh, well it's healthy but not healthy. Like You know I was one of those guys. Or eat Indian food for lunch and dinner ordered from outside, like home. Good Indian food, very healthy ordered from outside. Now it's full of butter and cream. Don't that all this
Travis Chappell (30m 43s): Stuff. Don't tell me that.
Ajit Nawalkha (30m 43s): My listening once, once, once in 10 days is okay, but you don't want that meal every single meal. Yeah. But I would eat that. And. I kept telling myself And I was very disciplined in everything else. Like I'm very, like, if I say I'm gonna work four hours, I only work four hours. If I say I'm gonna spend time with you, if I'll be here at 12 o'clock, I'm here at two to 12 or one to 12. Like, I'm like very, very disciplined as a person. Generally couldn't get myself to discipline on being healthy. Right. Until one day as my second kid, my daughter was born, I am playing with my kid outside. Right. And Austin, like you said, when it's hot, it's really hot. Right. Yeah. So it's like May 30th was my daughter's birth two years ago and my son was three years at that time.
Ajit Nawalkha (31m 23s): And this was like late July or something like that, or early July. So really hot outside. Oh yeah. So we are playing, I've like You know my wife's been so kind. She's been taking care of her daughter while her book is launching or getting ready to launch And. I was like, I'm gonna take this other one out and we are just gonna go hang out at the park. It's been a minute. You know. We were all in it for about a month, month and a half. We go out and we are hitting the park and we are running and we're running everywhere. You know like, hey, he's a three year old. He is immense amount. He doesn't care how hard it is. Our unlimited energy
Travis Chappell (31m 49s): That
Ajit Nawalkha (31m 49s): Dad finally is out. I'm familiar. Yeah. You have
Travis Chappell (31m 52s): Kids. Yeah. My son is four, my daughter is about to turn three.
Ajit Nawalkha (31m 56s): Yeah. So You know how it is, right? Yeah. Yeah. So you're running and you, they don't care. They don't give a shit. They're just running and I'm running, it's hot. And I'm like, ah. And I'm huffing and puffing and finally I stop. I'm like, alright, all, let's take a minute. Let's take a minute. And he's like, dadada, dadada. Come on, let's go. Cut's go. Yeah. Yeah. Like, listen, gimme a second, gimme a second. We've been running for so long. He's like, no, we have not been running for so long. What are you talking about? I was like, no, no, no, I need a second. I need a second. And he goes, ha, And, I. Go. Okay, Ari, Ari, I'm just Ari's my son's son's name. Ari, I'm really tired. Gimme a minute. What he said as a two year old, three year old at the time in dead in my eyes. And he looks right in my eyes and says, dad, you always tired.
Travis Chappell (32m 38s): Hmm.
Ajit Nawalkha (32m 39s): And. That crushed me in that second. I it, it was one of those things that you hear it and you're like, my son is this important to me? Like literally you question right. Yourself as a parent. In that moment, It was like three your I really? Yeah. And then I really inquired with myself. I was like, am I really always tired? Yeah. And yes, I was always tired and that wasn't because of the sleepless nights or or whatever else it was because I wasn't taking care of myself. I never went to the gym. I never went for walks. I ate like shit. And so I said, You know what this is.
Ajit Nawalkha (33m 19s): If I want to be the person that I say I wanna be, if this is my desire, what is my desire here? My desire is that when I am with my grandkids, if my children decide to have grandkids and we, we go for a walk and we are going on a hike, I don't wanna be the granddad that they're waiting to catch up
Travis Chappell (33m 36s): Or the
Ajit Nawalkha (33m 37s): Can't even go. Yeah. Or even won't go. I wanna be the grand that that's leading the path. That's what I want. I want when my kid turns 16, 17 when his kid, when his friends come in, they go, damn, your dad looks good. Right? What is he doing for workout? Let's work out with him. Right. I want that for my son or for my daughter. I want, when I take off my shirt, my wife goes, that's a per, I just wanna have sex with you because how you look,
Travis Chappell (34m 5s): That's my man right there. Right. Yeah.
Ajit Nawalkha (34m 6s): Right, right. I don't care. You could be the most beautiful human. I want your body. Yeah. Right. And I was like, if that's what I wanna be, that's not who I am today. Now that's real what I want now. I mean now I, I was 25% body fat when I started this journey. About two and a half years. At this point, when we are doing interview last recorded, which is last month, I was 13% body fat. Right. That kind of tells you the dramatic change and how I look, what I wear, how I act, how energetic I am through the day is completely defined because I have lost about 12% body fat. Yeah. Which is about half. Right. Right. And the journey's still on. It's only been two and a half years. Yeah. Right.
Ajit Nawalkha (34m 46s): To me, I've just begun this thing. But before that, I was 37 when the journey started or 36 and a half. Right. So the first 36 years of my life, I didn't make a decision. And I took one event. Yeah. Of really knowing what I want and getting clear about it. Life changes like this. Yeah. Right. Powerful. That's also why sometimes I tell people who may be thinking, oh, I can't change now. I wanna inquire that. I wanna be like, let's think about what you really want. Because the day you realize it, you'll find you can change like this.
Travis Chappell (35m 20s): Yeah. Yeah. That's such a good point, man. I, it was kind of similar for me. I was always athletic growing up. I played a bunch of sports and then I stopped when after college I got an, an ankle injury in my sophomore year of, of basketball in college and then surgery my junior year. And then I just was, I was just too slow to play And. I was in pain all the time. And I was just like, why am I continuing to do this? So I stopped, got married, my wife started cooking all this good food. I blew up to 250 pounds in about a year and a half from like 200, 2 0 5 to two 50 because I'm about six one. So like 200 for me is like a pretty solid, solid weight and didn't realize it happened.
Travis Chappell (35m 60s): So I go on this diet, I get super disciplined. I drop it drop back down to 200 pounds over the next four years. It's 200, 2 20, 200, 2 20, 200, 2 20. Just like back and forth, up and down Yoyo dieting and all this stuff. And And, I was kind of exactly what you're saying where it's just like, I, I was in periods of my life would be healthy or unhealthy or he or unhealthy. And kind of a similar thing with my kids was was You know what started to make me think more about like, You know what, at some point I just have to figure it out. 'cause I would tell myself all the excuses, right? Like, oh, well I travel a lot and it's difficult to eat well when you travel and it's difficult to stay in the gym and it's difficult to do this and difficult to do that.
Travis Chappell (36m 41s): And you're telling yourself all these stories. And the beginning of this year was like, was my kind of come to Jesus moment when I, I weighed in for, 'cause You know I was doing my health goals or whatever for the beginning of the year. And I weighed in And I was the same weight that I was at the beginning of last year, even though I had lost all the weight that I wanted to lose last year. So I was like, man, I did it again. I lost all the weight that I said I wanted to lose. And then I gained it immediately back. And I was just like, something else has to change here. And It was like at that moment that I was like, every, like my, it cannot, it has to stop being the fads and the diets and the six week Thad and the 75 days this and the three days. This like, it just, it's just gotta be the root base lifestyle change from the ground up or nothing's going to happen.
Travis Chappell (37m 25s): And to your point, it was just looking at what the alternative was going to be. You know what's the alternative? I either figure this out and be healthy and look great and feel great and have better energy levels and be able to play with my kids more and all that kind of stuff. Or I may as well just like write down a commitment to myself to be unhealthy and feel gross for the rest of my life. You know because that, that was where I got to me, where it was just like, I need to write, like I'm gonna commit to something today. You know I'm gonna commit to like fundamental lifestyle change to be healthy and feel good. Or I'm just gonna commit to being gross and overweight for the rest of my life. Mm. Because like the, the intermediate in between up and down back and forth is not gonna be something that I'm gonna do forever. You know and And I think like, I think forcing myself to just make that commitment at the beginning of the year was the thing that helped me ultimately.
Travis Chappell (38m 10s): But, and it was very similar. I was probably, I don't know, 20, 27% body fat or so at the beginning of the year. But now I'm about 11%, 11.5%. Cool. And it came from, like you said, getting very clear on what I wanted. And I didn't really realize how to articulate that until you were telling that story just now. And I. I appreciate you saying that because I, I think that that's a really good framework for not just health goals, but then using that and, and translating it across You know all the different domains of your life, which is, I assume what you do inside of your coaching business. So tell me a little bit more about Evercoach and what was the kind of catalyst for you to leave the thriving, growing community of Mindvalley To take a big risk again and start something brand new from scratch.
Ajit Nawalkha (38m 58s): It is an awakening or come to Jesus moment you can say. So I was, I was ACEO of the company. I really loved my work. I really think Mind Alley is a phenomenal company. It does a great job in the world. And at the same point, what I had found was, it was great at what I did. I loved what I did. But that's where the buck stopped. I just loved my work. And I didn't have a really good relationship with my then partner. It was a different person I was with. I had pretty much all my colleagues were my friends. And I had no friends outside of that. I had lost my relationship with my parents. I was completely unhealthy. I was just in this situation in life where it wasn't visible to me how everything's broken until one night.
Ajit Nawalkha (39m 40s): So, it was December 31st, 2014. And it was one of those You know New Year's nights you're out party. My partner was in Italy at the time and she wanted to be there. And I decided I'm gonna be in Qu Lumpur because of some work thing that I had to do. So I was out partying with my colleagues because that's all the friends I had. Yeah. And for some reason it, so Kuala Lumpur is kind of like New York a little bit, right? So how you get fireworks in New York for like New Year's and all of that, no dropping of the ball. But all of that fireworks type of situation happens in Paul and Port. So pretty much right around the midnight time you would come out to streets to like look at all the beautiful things that are happening around because just gorgeous to do that. It's very alive. Okay. Or used to be at that time.
Ajit Nawalkha (40m 20s): I haven't been there in a while, but, so I was out and about and somehow we got separated. All the colleagues went somewhere. And I was just alone by myself for a hot minute walking, trying to find them. And as we're walking, I see this beautiful Asian woman completely in white, which is odd for a New Year's Eve because usually you're in the dress or something. But this was like a spiritual dress almost. It's like one of those You know like gown type thing. Like a gown, which you don't expect on a New Year's Eve. Or at least not on the streets. Sure. So this beautiful Asian white gown, spiritual looking person starts to walk towards me and gets my attention. 'cause I'm like, Hmm, that's interesting to see somebody like that because nothing like that is around amazing energy. Also overall.
Ajit Nawalkha (41m 1s): So I'm looking at this person walking towards me, and she comes right up close, like real close to me, looks dead, looks at me dead in the eyes and asks me the question, who are you? I'm kind of like, I don't know. I know I did not know this person. I was getting, I was like, I don't know this person. Why are they asking you this question? This is a random, like, it's about to be midnight. Why is this question being asked? So I go Marette, and they look dead in my eyes and go again. No, who are you? I kind of go, who am I? I I go, I, I don't know. The person smirks at me and starts to walk away. Right? And by the time I turn around, the person's gone.
Ajit Nawalkha (41m 42s): So this chance interaction kind of throws me off on a New Year's Eve, while I'm kind of probably a little bit high on something. Yeah, it's possible. Yeah. But I'm kind of going, hold on, who am I? And then I couldn't sleep the rest of the night. Like I couldn't go to bed. Like I left that place. I got in the cab, got to my home and just lied down on bed pretty much the rest of the night wondering Who am I? Who am I? Who am I? My name je I do this thing in the world, but who am I? Like, I don't know the answer to this question. And this question kept bothering me for hours and for days. Really? Yeah. Yeah. So for the next two, three days, I'm still in this funk where I'm meeting people, but not really like, kind of like really being in this question that I cannot seem to answer at the time.
Ajit Nawalkha (42m 26s): And a week later, my, the, the co-founder, the founder of Mindvalley comes in because he was off to tall end with his family at the time. And he comes in And I pretty much the second day he's in. I say, bro, I think I need to quit. I, I think I need a reset. I, I think I, I've lost path of life. Like he's a really interesting person, but a very kind person at the same time. So he's like, okay, I understand. Can you gimme six months so I can recalibrate myself and the team? Sure. To be able to, because you're stepping, you're stepping down from CEO. It's not an easy task to just leave. Right? Yeah. So I was like, absolutely. It's a fair request. I'll give you six months. I'll be here six months. Alright. Done.
Ajit Nawalkha (43m 6s): And that started, the cascading effect of me changing is me going, okay, what else do I need to challenge? So I, I called my then partner, And. I said, we need to talk. I'm coming to Italy. She lived in Italy and her parents were in Italy. She was at their house. And. I had a really good relationship with her family as well. So I go there, And I say, well, I'm gonna, we gotta end this. It's not working for me. I don't think we have started on the route right foot. We are not on the right place. I do this whole thing. Like I talked to the whole family. I sat with them. We had a big cry about that separation. And, and that was the second thing that I let go. Then I, I started reaching out to my friends, like people who were friends for me since childhood.
Ajit Nawalkha (43m 48s): And I said, Hey, can I invite you all to come to Europe for like three weeks or 10 days, whatever we can make shift and make, make happen. Can we, can we go? Yeah. And I'll plan the trip. And then we took turns and we, all three of us, which was like our three buddies, three Musketeers, whatever you wanna call it, designed the trip of different cities that we would hop between, but mostly so we can refin the friendship that we always had. Yeah. Yeah. I go back, stay with my family for two weeks to re-understand what is my relationship with my parents and with my family. Where you came from? And. I go. Yeah. It's basically, it was month after month I was rediscovering. And during this process a lot of coaches were very supportive to me.
Ajit Nawalkha (44m 29s): Like without them I don't think I would have been able to do it. Okay. And they, they came off and on, like some of them were friends who were acting as coaches. Some were coaches, some were people I had hired to be coaches. Some people were present to be more because of the books they wrote or programs they created. But it was basically an immersion for about six or seven months. Just discovery of who am I as of now? Yeah. And what is it that I'm doing in the world. And that also brought my attention to that, the biggest change makers who are coaches in the world. To me at least the, maybe not the biggest, but the most deep and more impactful change makers that a per that a training can be or a conversation can be is a coaching conversation.
Ajit Nawalkha (45m 11s): And I was just so surprised to see that the most struggling entrepreneurs in the field of training is coaches is because they tend to be really good at this. But really terrible when it translates into anything that is financial. It's really terrible in knowing that the greatest way to build anything is to keep learning. Like the fundamentals that I had well understood, well mastered, was oblivious to them. They had no idea that that is actually the path to it. They would fall for the traps. Like we fall for the traps of the world by saying, if somebody comes in and say you need to have a social media following a coach will say, all right, that's what I gotta do. They'll drop everything and start doing that.
Ajit Nawalkha (45m 53s): Right? And they would constantly be like a hamster on the wheel. They would not get anywhere, even when their skills were so profound and so good, and so needed and so valuable, they would just stay on this hamster wheel. And so I decided that I have a unique gift, which is, I, I had built mind value already to about a $40 million company at that time with hundreds of thousands of students. I was like, I know a thing or two about how to do this thing really well. So I chose two endeavors. One was, I wanna be like the person that has just started. So I cut all ties and started pursuing clients One-on-one, like I said, I'm gonna find clients like how a coach will find clients literally through conversations, through events, through different dms or whatever, different ways, right?
Ajit Nawalkha (46m 35s): Yeah. Basically, I'm not gonna use what I already have in my backpack to start off this, this business. And so I started building a career as a business coach and a life coach, and parallel to this, as I was learning all of these things and the challenges and the mindsets and where are the traps and all of that, I started this company called Evercoach to not only learn for myself and transform my learnings, but actually bring the best trainers in the world and say, A coach shouldn't be limited by their certification. Hmm. That's the place you start. That's not the place where you end. So we built the first platform at the time where we were educating already certified and professional coaches to get better.
Ajit Nawalkha (47m 14s): So that's the, that's the platform that Evercoach was at the time. Now, eight years in Evercoach is a platform that does all of it. Like you can get certified through us now, we're, we are integrated more deeply integrated to Mindright than anything else in the world. Okay. To the extent that by the time this podcast comes out, we'll probably be renamed as Mindvalley coach, or some parts of us will call Mindvalley coach. Okay. Our certification unit, especially what we call Mindvalley coach, and, and we are still continuing the ever growing education through what is now developed into a membership. We are probably one of the largest YouTube channels and lot podcasting channels for coach education, specifically like that niche market, and Yeah. And, and we continue to serve the world.
Ajit Nawalkha (47m 55s): We, we have, we, we certify about 10,000 coaches every year. Wow. We serve about, I wanna say 15 to 20,000 coaches in total every year with paid programs. We serve about half a million people on our email list. Our total out social media reach is about the same, approximately. So should we have done a lot of work in the last seven and eight years, and, but it comes through because of this little event in my life where I found the most impactful people in the world are the ones that are served the least So. it was accidental that we started this thing, but I'm, I'm very glad that we did.
Travis Chappell (48m 30s): I mean, sometimes those are the best ones, right? Yeah. The accidental, you just kind of fall into this problem that exists and then you end up being the person who's actually most qualified to solve the problem itself. Yeah. Which seems like, seems like you definitely have. Tell me, tell me about your, the, some of the You know, you've mentioned relationship after relationship after, after relationship, and the show's called Travis, Makes. Friends and You know, part of it is just kind of a play on words, because I think it's fun to make friends myself, but also You know we are in a weird time when it comes to friendship. We're kind of in a loneliness epidemic. In fact, the US Surgeon General released a full document on loneliness and like how we can combat it, because it's becoming an increasingly worse problem every single year in, in the country.
Travis Chappell (49m 20s): Which is ironic because we're also the most connected we've ever been online You know what I mean? So, it, it to me is a strong case for continuing to put an effort into doing this. The in-person, the communication, the conversation, the hangouts, the trips, the experiences, the You know deepening and furthering of real relationships and friendships that sharpen you. And you clearly have had a lot of those throughout your life. Who would you say are maybe the top couple of You know most impactful relationships that you've had and, and, and why are they that way?
Ajit Nawalkha (49m 53s): So I believe each of the relationship brings a different kind of value to my life. So to isolate and say these are the most impactful, be unfair to those relationships or unfair to other relationships that I failed to mention. And, and here's the reason why. So while I'm not with my past partner, it was deeply impactful for me to be with them at the time because at that time, that was the right kind of relationship I needed. I wall through it and it wasn't the right relationship anymore. Because if we went in two different directions and approaches to life, and we, we lost a vision of where we wanted to go, and we became two visions and So, it wouldn't work. Right. But because of that is why I know that my current relationship with my partner, we pretty much every six months check in, are we still pursuing the same things?
Ajit Nawalkha (50m 39s): Yeah. Like at least the common vision, not the same thing, of course not because we're two different humans. Sure. But the same vision of family, the same vision of a relationship, the same vision of where we are going. Right. Is it that my current relationship is the most impactful in my life or my past relationship? Both of them are, they have their same qual, their, their different impacts in their lives. But if you talk about today in this moment, which are the most impactful relationships, I would say are my friendships, which are sometimes extending to my business partners. Yeah. And my, my personal relationship with my kids and, and my wife. Yeah. Those are the ones that have the greatest impact in my life on a day-to-day basis. How,
Travis Chappell (51m 13s): How do you go about, like, are, are, I guess, are you intentional about new relationships or new friendships or going different places to hang out or maybe staying at this particular type of hotel or flying this type of airline or like anything like that, that, that is intentionally putting you in a position to continually meet new, interesting people that can You know, sharpen or enhance your life?
Ajit Nawalkha (51m 38s): It's a very interesting question. It, and we all have different perspectives of friendships, right. So I am somebody who believes in depth of friendship Yes. More than breadth of it. Sure. So I may not have hundreds of friends, but the ones I do have, we have a deep bond. Yeah. Right. So to me, I'm not actively pursuing ideas to find friends. Okay. I don't have, I just makes friends. Yeah. I, what I do instead is, let's say today we have a chance meeting, right. You, my PR team reached out to you. You thought I would be an interesting guest. We are talking, say we feel connected. What will happen is our conversation, either you'll continue to text me or I'll continue to text you.
Ajit Nawalkha (52m 23s): Right. Either of the scenarios over time would either become a friendship or not become a friendship. Yeah. Neither of those impact our current conversation. So currently I'm fully present with you. It feels like you're fully present with me. Amazing. This is still a great connection, but will this become a friendship or not? Is something that you have to lean into the idea of how it matures. Because friendship is a lot about trust and trust. Yes. There are certain factors to it. And a lot of those factors are hit in a podcast like this because one of the factors are building trust is are we being vulnerable to each other? Right. A podcast encourages you to do, especially the quality of questions that you've been asking encourages me to be vulnerable. Right.
Ajit Nawalkha (53m 3s): So one factor is already done. Right. That's a big factor for friendship. Yeah. Another factor for friendship is are we agreeing to certain things and when we agree to those things, do we do them right? So if for example, you said, I'll just be here at 12 o'clock, And, I come at one, there's no reason Travis wants to be my friend. Yeah. Right. Travis is like, I'll do the podcast with you, bro, but I'm never texting you again. Right. Because you're coming an hour late. Right. So do we say what we are gonna do because that builds for the trust. Yeah. Because I can trust your word for it. Right. And the last thing, which is probably the reason why a friendship stays or doesn't stay is time. Yeah. Can you stay consistent and vulnerable over time? And if you do, you're friends.
Ajit Nawalkha (53m 45s): I think when we talk about the epidemic of loneliness, And, I, I have to look through how they've defined loneliness Yeah. And how they understand loneliness. But I think the epidemic of loneliness is more an epidemic of romantic relationships. It's because previously we would not call ourselves lonely because we always had one great friend and that was our partner. Right. It wasn't like that In the past times, we were drinking beer every night. That wasn't the case either. Right. They still had kids, they still had families. The men were able to go out, but women were still with kids with families. Right. Right, right, right. So how is it at that time they were not reporting loneliness, and today they are is because now they don't have friends, they don't have families and they don't have kids.
Ajit Nawalkha (54m 30s): Hmm. Because it is the most amount of over 40 single men and women that has ever been in America. Yeah. That is the case today. And so is with the Europe. Right. So the more advanced the society gets, the less likely we become to build a family because we are fearful. How would we feed more mouths in our family? Right. Because we wanna feel abundant and wanna be abundant. Now I want to get the fancy car, but I can't afford the fancy car with two kids.
Travis Chappell (54m 59s): Yeah. Right.
Ajit Nawalkha (54m 60s): Right. I take the fancy car And, I'm not having two kids. I've missed out on the joy of two kids, which is okay, it's a personal choice, but at the same point in time, that is what eventually leads you to feel lonely. Hmm. Because you become so self-centered Yeah. That you think you are the world. Right. That's my assumption and projection of that data point. I do wanna look at it and see how it's defined.
Travis Chappell (55m 22s): I'll send you the report. Yeah. It's, it's a fascinating read to I I I, I would read, I read some blog articles and stuff about it, and you see other people post, but then it was like, man, the US surgeon General puts out like a, a real report that's saying like, Hey, kind of warning everybody, like this is something that needs some attention here. You know, like, get involved in your community. Go meet some people. Get out. And like, but I agree a lot with your point though, that there's been a re-engagement of self lately that I think is romanticized to the degree that lack of responsibility has become the goal rather than abundance of responsibility. And, I think that there's a direct correlation between fulfillment and and happiness and the amount of responsibility that you are willing to take on in life.
Travis Chappell (56m 8s): And it feels better now to avoid it. Right. To like, like you said, to not have the kids and to not be in the relationship and to not have any of this other, and, and to get the things instead of the experiences. And it feels good. And it's like, but it's just a self You know. It's actually, it's not gonna
Ajit Nawalkha (56m 23s): Solve the, the problem. It's actually even feel like if the person who is feeling that way really inquires, I would, the the challenge is we don't inquire, we just succumb to say social media or TV or Netflix or whatever it is. It's actually not, I've been single. It's the most boring thing you can do after like a month or party, like after that. It's like, I'm like, this is just dumb. Yeah. Like, there shouldn't be anyone who wants to be single. You can choose if that's what you wanna choose. I'm just simply saying, have you inquired enough to really know if it's your fear Yeah. That is causing you to be single or it is actually that you wanna be single. Most people, because they're so fearful and they have an arbitrary random and so unnecessary standard that they put on a person.
Ajit Nawalkha (57m 8s): Yeah. An expectation that they put on a person, that they, even if love is standing right in front of them, they can't see it. Do you have that friend that always keeps dating the same person? Do you have one? I have like many. Yeah. Yeah. It's like they go, oh, I'm single again. I'm like, because it is the same guy that you've dated the last six times. It is just for different names and different bodies, but it's the same guy. Right. And it's the same gal. Right. Right. Right. No wonder you're a single because you go for the safest thing or safest type of person. Right. That you can go for. That is absolutely not what you want. But because You know this relationship will only last six months to a year. Right. You go for it because you don't go into self-inquiry and really have the hard, honest talk with yourself and saying relationship is not easy.
Ajit Nawalkha (57m 50s): No, nothing is like, life's not easy. Generally
Travis Chappell (57m 53s): Nothing worth having is easy. Is
Ajit Nawalkha (57m 54s): Easy and or it's not worth having. Right. Right. So that's the trap. That's the rub. Yeah, exactly. That's the crap. Right. We, we also decline, I mean, there's so many, like, we could talk about loneliness like for hours because there's so many factors that have changed in like, it, it is a big possibility that we define not lonely because people are going to church every Sunday. But does that really mean less, not lonely? Yeah. Or is the determinant the same? We just have, because of the variables that, which is why i, I love data. Yeah. And, I love how data can be manipulated to say whatever the Heck you wanna say. Sure, sure.
Travis Chappell (58m 27s): Right,
Ajit Nawalkha (58m 28s): Right. It's the same data set and you'll be like, holy cow. There are two different inferences. Like if, and this is, I have not read the report, but let's say hypothetically that was the logic of the report. It's like, oh, there were Sunday churches. You were involved in the community. Yeah. So I could say, we need to bring back church. Yeah.
Travis Chappell (58m 43s): Right.
Ajit Nawalkha (58m 43s): I'm not pro against religion. Right. Sure, sure. But I'm just saying you can take the same data and say, oh, no, it's not a loneliness epidemic. It's a religious epidemic. Right. And that's why we need to pursue more and have more churches, churches across the country. Right. It, it's the same dataset. Right. Right. So it's interesting how data works. I would love to read more about that. For
Travis Chappell (58m 59s): Sure. For sure. I'll send it to you, man, it was a fascinating read to me. For sure. Dude, this has been a lot of fun. I, I appreciate you coming on the show. Before we take off, where's the best place people can go learn a little bit more about you and find out some of the things you got going on. I know you said you're, you're giving away the book that you just bought back from your publisher, And I. Wish we had time to go into that. I meant to go into that with you. We'll have to maybe do a part two sometime and go into the details about that one, because I've always, I'm, I'm fascinated by the conversation of like self-publishing versus traditional publishing, especially in 2023. So curious to hear what your learnings were. If you could say it like a really quick synopsis, but then also tell us where we can get a, a copy of that book.
Ajit Nawalkha (59m 32s): Absolutely. Traditional publishing is fantastic. If you are looking for novelty and you want to explore ideas that are behind beyond your control. Hmm. But if you are a bigger platform than most publishers, which let's say I, I am in my category, I choose to self-publish. So most of my books are self-published. I did publish with a publisher when I was just starting my career, which is the book I just bought back because it was one of my best works. But it never saw traction like I would like it to see because it was the publisher. Nothing wrong with the publisher. Sure. That's just the publisher model, right? They, they invest in you when you are coming out for the first time. They put you in bookstores and so forth, but after that, it's your carry through. And it just never really made sense because I couldn't control the conversation.
Ajit Nawalkha (1h 0m 12s): Right. Because I didn't have the books, and this was not my book. I reached out to them, And I said, can I buy my rights back? I bought them earlier this year. And because I think that's still one of my best works and more broader than just coaching. It's, it addresses any entrepreneur, anybody who's looking to live a purposeful life. I decided I wanna just give it away. So the link will be in your show notes. My team will send it out to you and, and you just go and download the book. No strings attached. You have to make no shipping payment, nothing. Just simply enter your name and email address so we can send the book out to you and you'll have the book and then you can read the book. It's, it's one of the most among the better works that I've done, I believe. And yeah. But I do think if you wanna do something more novel, you wanna go more mainstream, traditional publishing route is better in summary.
Ajit Nawalkha (1h 0m 54s): So that's what, if you wanna connect with me on a daily basis, I post on Instagram pretty much twice a day. Okay. And I'm at, at Real, coach A. Got it. That's my handle. We'll also link that up, I guess, in show notes and you can find me there and
Travis Chappell (1h 1m 7s): The podcast. What's the, where's the podcaster? What the
Ajit Nawalkha (1h 1m 9s): Podcast in all platforms. The podcast is called Master Coaching with Ajit. It's, it's a little bit more directed to its coaches got So. it may not be interesting if you're not interested in coaching, but we talk about ideas like self coaching as well. So if that's your curiosity, it's, it's, it's worth checking out.
Travis Chappell (1h 1m 24s): Love it. Dude, thanks so much for coming on. This is a lot of fun. Like I said, maybe we can do a part two sometime next time I'm through Austin. But thanks for coming on, dude. This, this isn a fantastic chat in a lot of places that I didn't think we were gonna go, which is always fun for me. So
Ajit Nawalkha (1h 1m 35s): Thanks Travis. Thank you for having me.
Travis Chappell (1h 1m 37s): That's it for today's episode. Thanks for spending some time with me and my friends. If you want to be better friends with me, then head over to Travis Chappell dot com slash team to subscribe to my free newsletter, your friend Travis, where I share what's on my mind about life, building a business, raising kids, being married, and anything else I would normally share with my close circle of friends. That's Travis Chappell dot com slash team. And my biggest ask of you, since I'm sharing my friends with you, is to share this episode with a friend of yours that hasn't listened to the show yet. And leave us a quick five star rating in Apple, Podcasts And in Spotify. It would mean the world to us as it helps us make sure that this show continues to be more valuable to you. Thanks in advance and I'll catch you on the next episode.
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